Mauser Guns Collectors Forum

Pistols => Model 1910 Pistol => Topic started by: konopka on September 10, 2014, 03:12:01 AM

Title: Unusual Mod.1910
Post by: konopka on September 10, 2014, 03:12:01 AM
Hi everybody,
 What do you think about this unusual Mauser pistol ? It seems to be a mod. 1910 (slide type, caliber 6,35, magazine latch, magazine with flat bottom) but with a "square" rear frame and without "sidelatch", with black "sort of plastic" grips, with only one serial number on the left of the slide but only a "0" on the right side of the frame, and with a particular "cut out" on the right side of the frame.

(http://i56.servimg.com/u/f56/18/60/54/01/dsc00630.jpg) (http://www.servimg.com/image_preview.php?i=342&u=18605401)

(http://i56.servimg.com/u/f56/18/60/54/01/dsc00631.jpg) (http://www.servimg.com/image_preview.php?i=343&u=18605401)

(http://i56.servimg.com/u/f56/18/60/54/01/dscf7642.jpg) (http://www.servimg.com/image_preview.php?i=359&u=18605401)

I never saw another one like this one  :(

Thank you in advance for your thoughs/answers  :)
Title: Re: Unusual Mod.1910
Post by: 1914mauser on September 10, 2014, 07:57:17 AM
 It is a very unusual example and I am not sure what to make of it. Where did it come from? Is there any provenance with it? The frame has .32 caliber Humpback features as well as Sidelatch features. The grip is from a 1910/34 and appears to not fit like it should. I would suggest that they where replaced at some point. The front sight is not what I would expect but there are many things that are not what I would expect. The slide is 1910/14 new model. The magazine appears to be an aftermarket. What caliber is it? What is the serial number? I would almost say it has been photo-shopped but 3 different images? I would need to do an in hand examination and disassemble to comment further.
 
Regards,
Title: Re: Unusual Mod.1910
Post by: konopka on September 10, 2014, 08:18:20 AM
Hi and thank you for your comments  :)
[I would almost say it has been photo-shopped but 3 different images]
No, it hasn't been photoshopped  ;D and I can do other pictures of it, since it is in my posession.
I do not know anything of its provenance, since the french seller didn't know either of it.
[he frame has .32 caliber Humpback features as well as Sidelatch features]
yes, but without the sidelatch, that is the point. I saw some specimen with this square-ended frame but WITH sidelatch, and other WITHOUT sidelatch but with an "angle" at the rear of the slide.
[The grip is from a 1910/34 and appears to not fit like it should. I would suggest that they where replaced at some point.]
I agree  :)
[The front sight is not what I would expect]
The front sight is OK for a Mod. 1910 for me. Why wouldn't it be?
[What is the serial number? ]
SN is 33668
[The magazine appears to be an aftermarket]
I found a similar one - with the story that goes with it! here : http://www.defensivecarry.com/forum/defensive-carry-guns/99204-mauser-1910-25-a.html
(http://i39.servimg.com/u/f39/18/60/54/01/43963310.jpg) (http://servimg.com/image_preview.php?i=486&u=18605401)
As for the "cut-out", I found a similar one on the web at http://ernestartist.org/February03_2010_02.htm (http://ernestartist.org/February03_2010_02.htm):
(http://i39.servimg.com/u/f39/18/60/54/01/mauser11.jpg) (http://servimg.com/image_preview.php?i=485&u=18605401)
Title: Re: Unusual Mod.1910
Post by: 1914mauser on September 10, 2014, 10:24:17 AM
 Okay, then here are some more observations. I believe it is real. I just made the photo shop comment because it looks to be made up from different caliber and model variations. The French seller does point to the possibility that this came out of the factory collection. The “Mauser train” was looted in France and the French took possession of the factory post war because it was in their sector.  The cut out in the side plate (left side) is a humpback feature. The milled panel on the right side is typical of Humpbacks, 1914 early production and 1914 war era examples but only .32 caliber examples. This is the first time I have seen one on a .25 caliber. I now see that the magazine is a Sidelatch magazine but it is blued where Sidelatch magazines are typically nickel plated. The front sight is correct for a Sidelatch and I now see that the barrel take down rod is held in place by the typical Sidelatch notch in the bottom of the barrel. The serial number places it in the middle of Sidelatch production. Does it have the bottle neck shaped extractor?  My guess would be that you have a workshop prototype. It was most likely made to test some new ideas for production most notably the method of machining the trigger pivot into the frame so the side latch feature could be dropped. This is a best guess on my part. It could be a one-of-a-kind pistol. Congratulations!
 
 
Title: Re: Unusual Mod.1910
Post by: konopka on September 10, 2014, 10:46:17 AM
Thank you again for all these information!

[My guess would be that you have a workshop prototype]
hence maybe the "0" on the right side of the frame, under the slide (AN+ crown is the french deactivation marking :-[ ):

(http://i39.servimg.com/u/f39/18/60/54/01/dsc01018.jpg) (http://servimg.com/image_preview.php?i=492&u=18605401)

Here are some more close-ups I just made.

[Does it have the bottle neck shaped extractor?  ]
You mean like that?
(http://i39.servimg.com/u/f39/18/60/54/01/dsc01013.jpg) (http://servimg.com/image_preview.php?i=487&u=18605401)

Other details:
(http://i39.servimg.com/u/f39/18/60/54/01/dsc01014.jpg) (http://servimg.com/image_preview.php?i=488&u=18605401)

(http://i39.servimg.com/u/f39/18/60/54/01/dsc01015.jpg) (http://servimg.com/image_preview.php?i=489&u=18605401)

(http://i39.servimg.com/u/f39/18/60/54/01/dsc01016.jpg) (http://servimg.com/image_preview.php?i=490&u=18605401)

(http://i39.servimg.com/u/f39/18/60/54/01/dsc01017.jpg) (http://servimg.com/image_preview.php?i=491&u=18605401)
Title: Re: Unusual Mod.1910
Post by: 1914mauser on September 10, 2014, 11:31:07 AM
Yes, that is a Sidelatch bottle neck extractor. Please don't tell me this example has been deactivated? Are you in France?
 
Title: Re: Unusual Mod.1910
Post by: konopka on September 10, 2014, 11:42:24 AM
[Please don't tell me this example has been deactivated? Are you in France?]
I am afraid it has been  :-[ :'( Yes, I am in France, where the laws are somewhat stupid in some extend regarding guns (if you are only a collector - and not a shooter - you can't own any live guns!). I did buy this specimen already deactivated (I would never do such a thing ! >:( ).
Title: Re: Unusual Mod.1910
Post by: 1914mauser on September 10, 2014, 12:42:50 PM
That is truely a shame as it is a key peice to the evolution of the design.
Regards,
 
Title: Re: Unusual Mod.1910
Post by: konopka on September 10, 2014, 12:52:57 PM
Small consolation  :'( , it still can be cocked, stripped and dry fired !
Title: Re: Unusual Mod.1910
Post by: konopka on September 10, 2014, 02:58:06 PM
Inspecting furthermore this specimen, I noticed a small star on the bottom of the magazine. Any thought about that?
Cheers,
Philipp

(http://i39.servimg.com/u/f39/18/60/54/01/dsc01024.jpg) (http://servimg.com/image_preview.php?i=498&u=18605401)
Title: Re: Unusual Mod.1910
Post by: 1914mauser on September 10, 2014, 05:17:52 PM
The star on the base toe is typical of all Sidelatch magazines.
 
Regards,
 
Title: Re: Unusual Mod.1910
Post by: konopka on September 11, 2014, 04:04:46 AM
Thank you for all these valuable information!
Regards,
Philipp
Title: Re: Unusual Mod.1910
Post by: saxon on September 11, 2014, 11:42:23 AM
Do they weld a piece down the barrel?
Title: Re: Unusual Mod.1910
Post by: konopka on September 11, 2014, 11:47:42 AM
They weld the striker and force a screw in the barrel  :-[ :'( ! Those French barbarians!!! >:(
Title: Re: Unusual Mod.1910
Post by: saxon on September 11, 2014, 05:24:51 PM
as you say..barbaric!
Title: Re: Unusual Mod.1910
Post by: jcorl on October 08, 2014, 02:56:28 PM
That was a sad thread to read.  I did not know what deactivation was.  Guess I do now.

Great photos.  Thank you for sharing.

Jim ::)
Title: Re: Unusual Mod.1910
Post by: JohnS3 on March 15, 2016, 11:56:45 PM
This very informative and as already stated, SAD!:-( Thanks for the information.
Best regards,
John
Title: Re: Unusual Mod.1910
Post by: vlim on March 17, 2016, 12:01:22 PM
Interesting pistol.

Too bad it was deactivated. But is it still possible to strip the pistol to the point where the side plate can be removed?
I'm curious whether the side plate is numbered at the bottom and if there are traces of modifications on the inside.

It could be that the side plate was made for this pistol as a replacement by a competent gun smith, using a 1914 humpback side plate as a substitute piece. I've seen several examples of 1910 and 1914 pistols that had parts repaired/replaced in order to keep them going. I have a 1910 side latch with a gun smith made replacement barrel latch. Instead of the push button, it is held in place with a little screw.

b.t.w. the Mauser train was captured in Tirol, by the US Army. Not in France by the French army. The first crew to reach the train after its capture were actually British intelligence personnel. But most of the Mauser museum (and reference collection) was stored not far away from the factory in Oberndorf, and the French indeed captured Oberndorf and, sadly for us, the museum collection. Most of the collection was looted by French soldiers and many unique guns disappeared into illegality in France. Now and then, interesting guns do come out of the wood work there :)

Title: Re: Unusual Mod.1910
Post by: 1914mauser on March 17, 2016, 01:03:59 PM
Vilm,

Thank you for the history on the Mauser train. I should know it since I may have an example that may of been on it. I would love to inspect this example in hand though I am broken hearted by the fact it has been deactivated/butchered. I believe it was made from a combination of Humpback and Sidelatch parts but by who is not certain. Even in its current condition I would love to have it in my collection.

Regards,
Title: Re: Unusual Mod.1910
Post by: Warbird on March 17, 2016, 01:18:25 PM
Jim:  Deactivated guns in the U.S. are called "DEWATs" for DEactivated WArtime Trophies.
Title: Re: Unusual Mod.1910
Post by: jcorl on March 17, 2016, 02:46:15 PM
Thank you.  I was not aware of that term.  I just learned the other day what LGS stood for.   Local gun shop.   I thought it had more significant meaning.   I appreciate the education.   Regards,

Jim
Title: Re: Unusual Mod.1910
Post by: 1914mauser on March 17, 2016, 04:42:23 PM
And to those who speak Mauser, LGS can stand for Low Grip Screw as in HSC.

Regards,
Title: Re: Unusual Mod.1910
Post by: jcorl on March 17, 2016, 04:52:07 PM
That is exactly what I thought it meant.   I speak Mauser better than Gunboards. 

Jim