Author Topic: Such Thing as a Phosphate Police E/F  (Read 9801 times)

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rob67gt

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Such Thing as a Phosphate Police E/F
« on: August 14, 2013, 10:42:19 AM »
Warbird,

I continue to "lurk" out there more than contribute due to my personal demands but remain committed to the HSc.  Peter advised me of the change in format here on MauserGuns.com and the fact that you were now moderating the HSc section.  You were the already the unofficial moderator in the previous format and the new format is a pleasant surprise - CONGRATS.

I know you have maintained a database for years.  I was curious if you have ever recorded a phosphate E/F?  I recently acquired a late E/F (March 1945 production) which is still in military blue finish.  Personally, I have never seen anything but Army-proofed, phosphate-finished versions of the HSc.  Just curious.

I will strive to improve my photography skills and set aside some time to hopefully contribute more.....more likely when the weather becomes less pleasant.

Best regards - Rob

Warbird

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Re: Such Thing as a Phosphate Police E/F
« Reply #1 on: August 14, 2013, 01:01:20 PM »
Welcome back, Rob!  It's always a pleasure to have the more experienced and enthusiastic HSc collectors (re)join the rest of us here.  We look forward to your contributions in the future.

Now to your question ... there are NO 1945 phosphate Police Eagle/F examples in the database.  Most Police HSc's are mated with black plastic Grips.  As you may recall, the German Police were the first to officially document the plastic Grips in 1941, although they were only found on Army and Commercial variations that year.  Police usage began in January 1942.

If you refer to Reply #7 in the "HSc Production Chart" sticky, you can see that phosphate was the primary finishing used in most of the 1945 production except Police.  Hope that helps and let me know if there is anything else.
« Last Edit: August 14, 2013, 02:27:56 PM by warbird »

rob67gt

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Re: Such Thing as a Phosphate Police E/F
« Reply #2 on: August 14, 2013, 01:37:59 PM »
Thanks for the information and kind words Warbird.  Experience just means I am getting old, you and Peter are the real die hards.  I'm fortunate today as both the wife and I are off.  That means the lil' guy is under supervision while I wrestle with brake repairs on my pickup.....

Anyway, perhaps you can clear up my question if I provide a little more detail.  As I said, I have two E/F HSc both produced in about March of 1945 (Serial #s 947675 and 948113 if my spreadsheets are correct).  They are both military blue though I believe the later number has some phosphate parts [trigger and safety I think]).  Now I'm curious if the data base has phosphate E/F versions before and/or after this production time?  My phosphate is an Army in the late 949... series projected to be April '45 production. I suspect that the phosphate E/F are all in the very late production but have no proof of this just conjecture based on my observations.  I would love to see a pic of a late phosphate E/F if a member has one.

I rarely stumble across the "bakelite" grip versions in person and see most of them on the net.  Now always suspect as the repro grips are out there.



Lunch is over...back to work!

Thanks again.
« Last Edit: August 14, 2013, 02:09:42 PM by rob67gt »

Warbird

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Re: Such Thing as a Phosphate Police E/F
« Reply #3 on: August 14, 2013, 02:36:16 PM »
Rob, I modified my previous answer to you.  There are no Eagle/F Police phosphate finished HSc's recorded in the database.  My mistake ... must be having a senior moment here, although what I said about the plastic/bakelite Grips is correct.  That doesn't mean there weren't any Police phosphates, just that none have been reported so it's an open issue.

rob67gt

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Re: Such Thing as a Phosphate Police E/F
« Reply #4 on: August 14, 2013, 05:07:29 PM »
Another version for me to hunt down.  ;)   I'm guessing the Army took precedence over other organizations that late in the war.  It is really surprising that they were still marking with organizational proofs at all at that point.  If someone out there does have an E/F phosphate I would really appreciate seeing some pics of it.

jcorl

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Re: Such Thing as a Phosphate Police E/F
« Reply #5 on: August 14, 2013, 06:22:44 PM »
I have #947183 E/F and it is a weak, military blue finish.  Almost straw color on the frame like they did not leave it in the bluing vat very long.  Pretty close to your number. 
 
Jim
 
 
Jim

rob67gt

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Re: Such Thing as a Phosphate Police E/F
« Reply #6 on: August 14, 2013, 09:19:57 PM »
Jim,

Good to know there is a cousin to one of my E/Fs that made it through the time/war vortex!  Your number is indeed close.  Another goal of mine is to locate and acquire consecutively numbered HScs.  I assume yours has a stamped trigger like mine.  Any phosphate parts?

947675 is a recent acquisition and is all military blue.  The finish is spectacular dark military blue ~98+% with immaculate grips (original varnish present).  To be honest, in disassembling it it appears like it is almost in original unfired condition, with old dried grease present only on moving parts.

Several years ago I acquired a spectacular legit stone mint E/L that was reported to have been removed from a rail car.  Who knows, these could have both been on that same rail car.  Come to think of it about the same time or shortly thereafter an E/F sold on one of the online auction sites in its original shipping box with instructions.....perhaps that same rail car!?!?  Missed out on that one....regrettably.

Good Hunting.

jcorl

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Re: Such Thing as a Phosphate Police E/F
« Reply #7 on: August 14, 2013, 10:46:19 PM »
Rob,  No phosphate parts on mine.  Very, very good condition, but just weak on the bluing up the front grip.  My "F" was captured near an American POW camp in Germany.  The N.Y. vet that sold it to me just before going into a retirement home, said he ran into a police officer with a sully tone near Schweinfurt.  (Just checked my notes on that town)    They had just seen the poor treatment provided for our POWs.   He said he took no lip from the cop and grabed his gun from him.  It is a nice story as it places the weapon in action late in the war, when that camp was set free.  Sounds like you have a beautiful example (or Two).  Guess mine was not on that same rail car.  Glad to know someone with a gun so close to my numbered example.  And yes, stamped trigger to answer your question.
 
Regards,  Jim
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
« Last Edit: August 15, 2013, 10:30:08 AM by jcorl »
Jim